Topic: North Korea (Read 1022 times)

Bowlnik · « **on:** February 20, 2007, 07:28:12 AM »

Some of you may or may not have been paying attention to the news lately, but as a political science major I find that watching the news is part of studying. Something of great concern has happened in these recent weeks. The Bush administration has made concessions to North Korea to get them to abandon their nuclear weapons program.

I am ordinarily a fairly liberal person, I believe that our current foreign policy is dangerous and irresponsible. But this action is dangerous and sets precedents that will harm world peace and security for decades to come.

We have let every tinpot dictator know that all that he needs to blackmail the West is the Bomb. That they will be given the international respect they yearn for, and the money that follows. This is Unacceptable.

We initially took a hardline on the North Korea issue, a hardline that I myself do not believe to be hard enough. North Korea is a rogue state, they are a dangerous threat to the world order, and they can not be permitted to entertain the illusions of grandeur that we have played right into.

When this initially happened, I believed the best course of action, short of some kind of military deployment (perhaps surgical strikes or something similar) was to deploy a fleet to North Korea, and put them under a full blockade. I still believe that to be the best course of action, UN Policies be d-mn-d, as far as Kim Jong Il is concerned, he is at War with the UN.

Unlike the Iranians, (Some portions of their government are fanatical, but they are not a dictatorship) Kim Jong Il is actually and honestly insane. He has time and again broken his treaties and agreements and he is in gross violation of International Law, and we went, and we rewarded him for it.

I can only hope that Bush will see that he is taking the hardlines in the wrong places and that North Korea is far more of a long-term threat to international security than Iran. (Not that Iran isn't)

Copernicus · « **Reply #1 on:** February 20, 2007, 12:30:00 PM »

Given that we have forces deployed in two foreign locations already and cannot keep up with recruitment quotas, it would be very difficult financially and physically for us to embark on another military action. The situation in Iraq is deteriorating every day, and there are elements in the government that would like us to expand the mess into Iran. After all, Ahmadenijad is just as certifiable as Kim Jong Il. Moreover, China would not be very happy with US troops engaged in military actions near its borders. So I don't see any practical benefit to a military strike. It would seem to just get us into a deeper hole than we are in already.

I am surprised that the Bush administration actually achieved a diplomatic coup in North Korea, after its record of bumbling failures almost everywhere else. The new agreement puts inspectors back into their nuclear facilities, and it has a chance of reigning in Kim Jong Il a little. After all, he hasn't exactly helped his country's fortunes. So the new agreement is a face-saving way for him to get back into the wary graces of the rest of the world. Now, if only Bush could manage to calm things down with Iran, we could focus on more serious issues. Like extracting ourselves from the mess in Iraq with as little egg as possible on our collective faces.

Bowlnik · « **Reply #2 on:** February 20, 2007, 12:38:19 PM »

To be honest, I don't think Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is that insane. Anti-US, Anti-Semitic, and Anti-West sure, but not insane. I think he is more talk than anything else. Given the country he is the President of, it is to be expected.

And Yes, our military forces are stretched thin, in terms of infantry. But our navy is still the largest in the world and it has more than sufficient power to effect a blockade.

Copernicus · « **Reply #3 on:** February 20, 2007, 02:00:18 PM »

Quote from: Bowlnik on February 20, 2007, 12:38:19 PM

And Yes, our military forces are stretched thin, in terms of infantry. But our navy is still the largest in the world and it has more than sufficient power to effect a blockade.

Most of North Korea's supplies are shipped in by rail from China, so a blockade would hardly bother Kim Jong Il. Our main strategy was to get the Chinese to put pressure on North Korea, and it worked. Much better than military action.

Bowlnik · « **Reply #4 on:** February 20, 2007, 05:14:41 PM »

That is true, yes. But what I worry about is precedent. Yes, this may be been a success in terms of getting the Chinese to pressure the NKans, but it sets a dangerous precedent. Namely, get the bomb, and get respect, indeed, get rewarded. They profited from their violation of international law: That is unacceptable.

Copernicus · « **Reply #5 on:** February 20, 2007, 07:04:04 PM »

Quote from: Bowlnik on February 20, 2007, 05:14:41 PM

That is true, yes. But what I worry about is precedent. Yes, this may be been a success in terms of getting the Chinese to pressure the NKans, but it sets a dangerous precedent. Namely, get the bomb, and get respect, indeed, get rewarded. They profited from their violation of international law: That is unacceptable.

But the precedent has already been set with India and Pakistan. I worry far more about radicals taking over Pakistan and initiating a nuclear exchange with India. In the case of India, we have now welcomed them into the nuclear club with open arms. They are going to serve as our main ally in southern Asia, and they will certainly be a counterweight to China.

Bowlnik · « **Reply #6 on:** February 20, 2007, 08:03:20 PM »

Well, that is a somewhat different matter. First off, yes, Pakistan is unstable and that is a matter of concern, however, they were not actually rewarded for their treaty violations, it is just that the West mostly turned a blind eye to it. Yes, India and don't forget to mention Israel are our allies. Ultimately, I am not talking about fairness here, I am talking about what is in the best interests of the United States, and that does not involve rogue states (Pakistan and India aren't) having nuclear weapons.

Copernicus · « **Reply #7 on:** February 20, 2007, 11:31:59 PM »

But Pakistan and India are most likely to get into a shooting war. They aren't trying to blackmail us into bribing them not to manufacture. Iran just wants them so it can be a regional bully. North Korea is just trying to blackmail people into paying it off not to manufacture weapon grade material. That is the real appeal of nuclear weapons for cash-poor 3rd-world countries. They represent a great source of income. And North Korea desperately needs the income. Kim Jong Il isn't that stupid. He knows that he'll be obliterated if he actually attacks someone with a nuclear weapon. On the other hand, he can threaten to sell the materials and technology to terrorists.

The scary thing about Pakistan is that it might get taken over by religious nutcases, like Iran was. Those people think that Allah wants them to punish infidels, and especially Hindu infidels. It could become a real mess.

Bowlnik · « **Reply #8 on:** February 21, 2007, 07:36:45 AM »

I wasn't never meaning to imply that Kim Jong Il would use the weapons, merely, that we have played into his hand by folding to his blackmail, precisely along the lines of what you are saying.

Author Topic: North Korea (Read 1022 times)

Bowlnik

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Copernicus

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